My Fiat/Bertone X1/9 Project

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CobraElite
Posts: 7
Joined: July 23rd, 2013, 9:15 am

My Fiat/Bertone X1/9 Project

Post by CobraElite » July 28th, 2013, 1:09 pm

Hello everyone! how are you all?

I had been reading this forum on and off for the last year and thought it would the right time to join and show everyone my project, and also get some advice about some queries i have.

I brought the car from a man in Leeds over 4 years ago, this is what it looked like back then:
01 X19 original.jpg
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02 X19 original.jpg
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03 X19 original.jpg
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After a couple days of having the car and checking everything out i had took off the bumpers and started creating a list of what needed to be done.
04 X19 original.jpg
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05 X19 original.jpg
05 X19 original.jpg (61.68 KiB) Viewed 7062 times
While looking for some parts for the car i came across these two photos.
Hill Climb.jpg
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Black X19.jpg
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Within weeks i had brought the body kit, CSC exhaust, Compomotive deep dish alloys and other goodies which would be put onto the car
33 Exhaust.jpg
The CSC Exhaust
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32 Wheels.jpg
The Compomotive Deep Dish Wheels
32 Wheels.jpg (54.98 KiB) Viewed 7062 times
The day came when me and my father started to get to work
01 Body kit temp placed over old.jpg
Placing body kit onto the car
01 Body kit temp placed over old.jpg (56.14 KiB) Viewed 7062 times
05 PS rear wing off.jpg
Starting to cut the metal away
05 PS rear wing off.jpg (54.25 KiB) Viewed 7062 times
16 Inner wing.jpg
While we had the chance we treated all the rust and then painted with Hammerite
16 Inner wing.jpg (43.84 KiB) Viewed 7062 times
23 Spoiler problem.jpg
As you can see the kit didn't fit exactly prefect
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17 DS Front fixed on.jpg
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19 Front Spoiler fixed on.jpg
Fixed the front spoiler problem while cutting the bottom, moving it into place then fiber glass to get the straight edge
19 Front Spoiler fixed on.jpg (37.36 KiB) Viewed 7062 times
21 PS front & Rear on.jpg
Both the front and back arches on
21 PS front & Rear on.jpg (41.36 KiB) Viewed 7062 times
Then after rubbing the car down and spraying with primer the car ended up looking like this
28 Primer.jpg
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29 Primer.jpg
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Then it got sent to the body shop, who without mentioning names will never be used again as the overall finish was okay but there was somethings which shouldn't of happened. It looked like he was smoking while spraying as their is small specks stuck in the paint, had over sprayed into the car so the dash/steering wheel etc was now covered in paint, front arch has a pipe mark where he had dragged it over the wet paint and there was a paint run under the windscreen. He refused to redo as it was a "hard car to spray"...... right...
The spoiler which is on the car in the photos has now been taken off, looking at finding the "X1/9 Prototipo 2000 Abarth" boot/spoiler, but without the snorkel.
04 Painted.jpg
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08 Painted.jpg
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09 Painted.jpg
I reckon this is the best view of the car
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13 Painted.jpg
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Recently it passed it's M.O.T surprisingly well, and is now being driven around. This is where some problems have came up which i need a bit of advice on. The car seems to struggle in bumper to bumper situations, you can't get the car to nudge forward it will just jolt forwards. It also seems for the speed you are going revs very high, hard to explain but i think the clutch might have some oil on it. When i first brought the car, there was a oil leak coming from the gearbox.

I have always been looking at the engine upgrades/transplants. I know about the Uno Turbo, GT Punto, Lancia Delta etc. But i was wondering what kind of power i could get out of the original engine. I'm not expecting an engine with 250+ bhp, something around 130-150 would be nice and maybe with the potential for a bit more later down the line. But also has to be able to be drivable in all situations etc.

All comments, criticism and advice is welcome.

fingers99
Posts: 99
Joined: December 9th, 2009, 6:24 pm
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Re: My Fiat/Bertone X1/9 Project

Post by fingers99 » July 28th, 2013, 8:57 pm

Nice looking car.

Does sound like you may have a gearbox oil seal bearing allowing oil to contaminate the clutch. You may be able to smell the (particularly unpleasant) pong of hypoid gear oil if there are any drips under the casing to catch with your finger.

I wonder how a centrifugal supercharger would suit the car?

Not sure how (and if) X1/9 folk talk to each other, but there's someone on Fiat Forum with a Dallara one, out of which some miscreant nicked the engine.
GC_06

LanciaNut69
Posts: 61
Joined: June 22nd, 2011, 10:45 am
Location: Newbury, UK

Re: My Fiat/Bertone X1/9 Project

Post by LanciaNut69 » July 29th, 2013, 7:11 am

Hi CobraElite, and welcome,

This is a subject that is close to my heart, as I have just added an X1/9 to my collection and am still deciding whether to fit the Dallara kit I have, or just go with the quarter bumpers and flared arches. Where did you get the wheels from by the way?

There is a lot you can do with the standard engine to make it fun to drive, and there are far more qualified people than I who can comment on that. Various alternatives have been done as a transplant, from Uno Turbo, Fiat/Lancia twin cam, Volumex, and even V6s! I know of a 12 valve, 24 valve, and even a 3.2 24 valve! My personal opinion is that putting a large engine in the car will completely change its 'raison d'etre'. It's designed to be nimble with crsip handling; putting a large and heavy lump will change that completely.

If you're set on changing the engine, I'd go with Uno Turbo because it's a very straight forward install and you can get good, reliable power, but that is just my opinion.

Keep the photos and progress reports coming!

All the best

Darren
__________
Book #435

CobraElite
Posts: 7
Joined: July 23rd, 2013, 9:15 am

Re: My Fiat/Bertone X1/9 Project

Post by CobraElite » July 29th, 2013, 8:28 am

Hi fingers99 & LanciaNut69, thanks for the reply's!
Does sound like you may have a gearbox oil seal bearing allowing oil to contaminate the clutch. You may be able to smell the (particularly unpleasant) pong of hypoid gear oil if there are any drips under the casing to catch with your finger.
Yes i think that would be the case, which is a bit of a pain. I think that's why i have started getting interested in upgrading the engine as then i can have everything redone at the same time and fitted at once, instead of doing it multiple times.
I wonder how a centrifugal supercharger would suit the car?
I wonder the same as well. Not long ago i was looking at the Mini Cooper supercharger, thinking if i could fit this. Another reason i am here to seek advice.
Not sure how (and if) X1/9 folk talk to each other, but there's someone on Fiat Forum with a Dallara one, out of which some miscreant nicked the engine
Yes i know who you are talking about and that was a shame to hear about that, a lot of hard work had been put into that engine/car. We do talk to each other, but i was looking more for facts about what type of engine GC could build for me etc.
This is a subject that is close to my heart, as I have just added an X1/9 to my collection and am still deciding whether to fit the Dallara kit I have, or just go with the quarter bumpers and flared arches. Where did you get the wheels from by the way?
Do you mean like the X1/9 Prototipo Abarth?
Bertone27.JPG
X1/9 Prototipo
Bertone27.JPG (100.57 KiB) Viewed 7023 times
I personally prefer the Dallara kit over the Abarth one. I got the wheels of an internet auction site, for a good price as well if i remember right. When ever i see them on an internet auction site now there are going for around £400/500.
There is a lot you can do with the standard engine to make it fun to drive, and there are far more qualified people than I who can comment on that. Various alternatives have been done as a transplant, from Uno Turbo, Fiat/Lancia twin cam, Volumex, and even V6s! I know of a 12 valve, 24 valve, and even a 3.2 24 valve! My personal opinion is that putting a large engine in the car will completely change its 'raison d'etre'. It's designed to be nimble with crsip handling; putting a large and heavy lump will change that completely.
Yes i agree with you there, that's why i would prefer just to improve the engine instead of swapping it. One of the main things about the X1/9 is the handling and i don't want to take that away.
If you're set on changing the engine, I'd go with Uno Turbo because it's a very straight forward install and you can get good, reliable power, but that is just my opinion
Another option i was/still considering as it is nearly a straight swap. But when i search online, i don't see many parts for sale. Which means it could be a pain in the unacceptable to get parts if something happens. What puts me off a lot.
Keep the photos and progress reports coming!
Will do! I have to buy some vents for the rear arches and a clutch slave cylinder, so these will be the next photo's.

I've been search through the GC forum and found this
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=499 (Fiat X1/9 advice and suggestions)
I am interested in what he did in the end, how much BHP/Torque did he get.

Thanks all

Brian

LanciaNut69
Posts: 61
Joined: June 22nd, 2011, 10:45 am
Location: Newbury, UK

Re: My Fiat/Bertone X1/9 Project

Post by LanciaNut69 » July 29th, 2013, 7:43 pm

Hi Brian,

No, the prototipo arches are a little extreme for what I want - apparently there are other arches available that are not quite as extreme. I have a set of Compomotives I plan on using, which are 15" and aesthetically work better for me. I'll post up some pics when I get round to starting work on it - too much stuff in the workshop that needs attention first!

All the best

Darren
__________
Book #435

CobraElite
Posts: 7
Joined: July 23rd, 2013, 9:15 am

Re: My Fiat/Bertone X1/9 Project

Post by CobraElite » July 30th, 2013, 12:14 pm

What are you planning to use for for?

yes sounds the same for me, gotta do some body work on a Suzuki Vitara before i can get back to work on mine as it is taking up too much room in the garage. Funny thing is it has more rust than my x1/9 some how.

I'm wondering what X1/9 engines Guy Croft has done? and what power did he gain from them?

LanciaNut69
Posts: 61
Joined: June 22nd, 2011, 10:45 am
Location: Newbury, UK

Re: My Fiat/Bertone X1/9 Project

Post by LanciaNut69 » July 30th, 2013, 1:05 pm

Hi Brian,

I plan to use the car for both road and track, as a bit of fun and as both a testbed for modifications and as a mobile display of my work. The same is true of LRB (my Montecarlo), which will be fitted with a 12 valve V6 from a 164 Cloverleaf.

With regard to what Guy has done, your best bet is to contact him directly, either by telephone or email and you can discuss your requirements in some detail and I'm sure Guy will give you some realistic information as to what you can expect from your engine.

All the best

Darren
__________
Book #435

Guy Croft
Site Admin
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Location: Lincoln, UK
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Re: My Fiat/Bertone X1/9 Project

Post by Guy Croft » July 31st, 2013, 12:01 pm

I just would not change to any other engine!

The TC conversion is hugely complicated and most run out of money before finishing. Other donor units you mention like Uno Turbo - you will never find a decent donor unit these days.


I have done numerous types of SOHC for these cars, all powerful and eminently driveable.

GC
Attachments
GT SOHC_ carb rigged (1).JPG
1300 SOHC for Geraint Thomas, now out and about and doing well at 110bhp on rallies like the Ypres and Epynt
GT SOHC_ carb rigged (1).JPG (137.8 KiB) Viewed 6930 times
13.jpg
13.jpg (564.66 KiB) Viewed 6930 times
Guy Croft, owner

CobraElite
Posts: 7
Joined: July 23rd, 2013, 9:15 am

Re: My Fiat/Bertone X1/9 Project

Post by CobraElite » August 4th, 2013, 9:15 am

Where will you be racing it LanciaNut69?

yes i think have decided to just keep the original engine. If it was 10 years ago I might of gone down the Uno Turbo route, but as GC says it will be hard to find a good one.

I'll be emailing you soon GC to follow up about the engine.

I'll hopefully have some more pictures for you lot next weekend, I've had no time to work on the car at the moment due to my business.

Thanks
Brian

CobraElite
Posts: 7
Joined: July 23rd, 2013, 9:15 am

Re: My Fiat/Bertone X1/9 Project

Post by CobraElite » August 25th, 2013, 6:16 pm

Sorry everyone for not putting anymore pictures up, still been really busy. Buying new stuff this week though so hopefully i will get the chance to work on it.

Not sure if you have read this thread GC, but i have emailed you about some engine work on the car. If you could check your emails that would be great.

thank you everyone

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